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Discussion Starter #1
http://www.nopi.com/dsp_parts.php?vpcid=1209

Does anyone have these tein pillowball upper mounts? Were they worth the money (they look like they are- big time) and, most importantly, know how many degrees of camber adjustment these mounts offer for our 4th gens? I already have the KYB AGX struts, and am contemplating Neuspeed Race springs, in which I figure I may need a camber kit, and no matter what the drop of the springs, I wanted solid pillow ball mounts (better than rubber ones), so I'm thinking this is the perfect way of getting my pillow ball mounts and camber kit in one. This looks almost too good to be true.

So, does anyone know the degree range of adjustability for our 4th gens with these? I've searched around but it doesn't seem to say anything specific.

Also, this would probably be my best method of having a camber kit on my car, yeah? I'm thinking it would be better than a sliding balljoint, or other types. Some solid feedback from someone who has these would be great, but any information anyone has would be great, as I may buy these on the spot when I hear back. I need to get my lude lowered baaaaad. So shoot away o thee knowledgeable luders!!!
 

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i think your link is broke...or, at least, i can't get it to come up.

but pillowballs on a forth gen don't do jack for camber adjustment. your is set by the upper and lower ball joints on the upper and lower control arms.

a pillow ball is typically used on the top of a strut....which doesn't have or touch the upper or lower control arms or ball joints.

i'm not really sure what purpose a pillow ball will serve on any UCA honda (88-01 civics, 84 up preludes, 86-03 accords), aside from taking an unnoticeable amount of rubber out of the suspension.


edit: and damn....$250-$300 for a bearing in a hat that doesn't do a damned thing. P.T. Barnum (well, David Hannum, actually) was right.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
From what they had advertised, it said it to mean that it adjusted the wheels camber, not the struts angle. When you said "a pillow ball is typically used on the top of a strut....which doesn't have or touch the upper or lower control arms or ball joints", thats when it clicked and I realized that it adjusted the angle of the strut/spring, not the wheels camber arrangement when I have an alignment done.

But there's still no difference between using rubber top hats on the strut/spring and aluminum pillow ball mounts for the top of my suspension? It seems to me that the aluminum ones would keep strut play in check, but that's just me. But that's probably not worth $220 I'd imagine...correct? Apparently KYB makes some $9 upper strut mounts I'm going to go for... unless anyone has used a better part for the top of their suspension?


i think your link is broke...or, at least, i can't get it to come up.

but pillowballs on a forth gen don't do jack for camber adjustment. your is set by the upper and lower ball joints on the upper and lower control arms.

a pillow ball is typically used on the top of a strut....which doesn't have or touch the upper or lower control arms or ball joints.

i'm not really sure what purpose a pillow ball will serve on any UCA honda (88-01 civics, 84 up preludes, 86-03 up accords), aisde from taking an unnoticeable amount of rubber out of the suspension.


edit: and damn....$250-$300 for a bearing in a hat that doesn't do a damned thing. P.T. Barnum (well, David Hannum, actually) was right.
 

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can you post the correct link to what you're referring to? the one you posted doesnt work.
i'd like to see this for myself, because tein doesnt make pillowball mounts for preludes
 

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Discussion Starter #5
http://www.nopi.com/dsp_pcsall.php?vmodelid=40

this is the link to the nopi page for preludes, then go down and youll find
"susp align - pilow ball up mount"
its alphabicalized so youll find it its easy.

i guess the direct link for the page i was referring to doesnt work.

by the way motoxxxman, you have a pm re: a basemap for my prelude


can you post the correct link to what you're referring to? the one you posted doesnt work.
i'd like to see this for myself, because tein doesnt make pillowball mounts for preludes
 

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i just woke up, i'll reply to the pm in a few when im more with it, basically after i have my coffee lol. but i did find what you're talking about. and this is what the description says:
"Pillowball upper mounts are designed to offer greater feed back by eliminating the deflection in OEM rubber bushings. A NWB spherical bearing is used in place of the rubber bushing, which allows for improved tire grip and more accurate wheel alignment. In vehicles with front strut type suspension, an adjustable camber plate is incorporated into the upper mount. Degrees of adjustment will range depending on application."


it says "in vehicles with strut type suspension, an adj camber plate..."... preludes have shock type suspension, not strut type. when they refer to strut type, they're talking about mcphereson type struts where the strut is the upper control arm, like in dsm's. thats just a general description, not a description specific to the prelude.
this mount for the preludes is just an upper spring perch with no rubber bushings to replace the stock perch. it gives the shock more control with zero distortion from rubber bushing deflection. worth it for an all out race car, not so noticeable in a DD car though. and it has zero adjustability
 

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Just in response to your concern about the negative camber w/ Neuspeed Race springs, it's not THAT bad. I have a few pics of my car on them in the picture thread.
 

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But there's still no difference between using rubber top hats on the strut/spring and aluminum pillow ball mounts for the top of my suspension? It seems to me that the aluminum ones would keep strut play in check, but that's just me. But that's probably not worth $220 I'd imagine...correct? Apparently KYB makes some $9 upper strut mounts I'm going to go for... unless anyone has used a better part for the top of their suspension?
with the teins, you are wanting to replace a rubber bushing that has about 1/8 to 1/4" of play when bolted down with a $240-$290 piece of aluminum that gives about 1/16" of play....and a shit load of noise.

i can't imagine the stock bushings are sloppy enough to notice, and if they are, one could easily shave down the metal spacer bushing to make it tighter.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
i just woke up, i'll reply to the pm in a few when im more with it, basically after i have my coffee lol. but i did find what you're talking about. and this is what the description says:
"Pillowball upper mounts are designed to offer greater feed back by eliminating the deflection in OEM rubber bushings. A NWB spherical bearing is used in place of the rubber bushing, which allows for improved tire grip and more accurate wheel alignment. In vehicles with front strut type suspension, an adjustable camber plate is incorporated into the upper mount. Degrees of adjustment will range depending on application."


it says "in vehicles with strut type suspension, an adj camber plate..."... preludes have shock type suspension, not strut type. when they refer to strut type, they're talking about mcphereson type struts where the strut is the upper control arm, like in dsm's. thats just a general description, not a description specific to the prelude.
this mount for the preludes is just an upper spring perch with no rubber bushings to replace the stock perch. it gives the shock more control with zero distortion from rubber bushing deflection. worth it for an all out race car, not so noticeable in a DD car though. and it has zero adjustability
word i see what you're saying. those bastards!!! i thought i had finally found a perfect way to eliminate shock tower play and do camber alignment. oh well fuck it, like psychoboy said, yeah $290 to eliminate what will come down to 1/8" of strut play is not worth the money. shit, thats almost what the agxs cost me!!!

nopi got me there. i hate those generalized descriptions. if it doesn't work on my car, tell me that straight up bitches!!! haha, thats almost as bad as seeing a "jdm" intake on ebay. ok im done ranting. damn i almost bought those things too, good thing i asked about it first, or you guys woulda seen a FS thread for some shit that dont even fit your car. who knows if i would have received the adjustable ones that arent for my car, or the non-adjustable ones that arent what i ordered. bah!!! :rocketwhore: to hell generalized descriptions. mcdonalds does that shit too. they dont bother to tell you what comes on your burger, so you know what to ask them to keep.

this is an attemt at humor. i am not an angry person.:cool:
 

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preludes have shock type suspension, not strut type.
incorrect

Struts integrate numerous suspension parts into one compact assembly, including the coil spring, spring seats, shock absorber, strut bearing, and steering knuckle. Its spring can support the weight of the vehicle, while moving to adapt to road irregularities. The internal shock absorber dampens movement of the spring as it compresses and rebounds during vehicle travel. The strut housing serves as a structural part of the suspension system and connects the upper strut bearing to the lower ball joint so that the entire assembly can pivot when the steering wheel is turned.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
yeah i was pretty sure preludes had a strut type suspension, but didn't say anything as it wasnt connected to the topic.

anyways, what the hell does this mean now? for my 4th gen, these pillowball mounts ARE camber adjustable? and if so, wheel camber (my concern) or angle of the strut camber?

im confused now. someone who has bought this shit needs to step up and tell us which is what, or what is which, or whatever. haha this whole thing with fearing a massive camber problem when i do my lowering job (thats why im looking into different types of camber adjustments) is holding up the actual doing of the job here

please someone set this all straight
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
HONDA PRELUDE BB1 92-96
Ft, S/P I.D.=70, Incl. 4ws PRH28-31S70
$290.00
HONDAPRELUDE BB1 92-96
Rr, S/P I.D.=70, Incl. 4wsPRH29-31S70
$240.00
HONDAPRELUDE BB2 92-96
Ft, S/P I.D.=70, Incl. 4wsPRH28-31S70
$290.00
HONDAPRELUDE BB2 92-96
Rr, S/P I.D.=70, Incl. 4wsPRH29-31S70
$240.00

what does this all mean? i get it all except the S/P I.D. = 70 part. I put every other in bold so its easier to seperate
 

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incorrect

Struts integrate numerous suspension parts into one compact assembly, including the coil spring, spring seats, shock absorber, strut bearing, and steering knuckle. Its spring can support the weight of the vehicle, while moving to adapt to road irregularities. The internal shock absorber dampens movement of the spring as it compresses and rebounds during vehicle travel. The strut housing serves as a structural part of the suspension system and connects the upper strut bearing to the lower ball joint so that the entire assembly can pivot when the steering wheel is turned.
you totally just proved that i am indeed correct lol. read what you just wrote.

you're thinking shocks as in truck type shocks.
preludes have shock type struts. meaning they work only as a shock and spring.
struts (mcphereson struts) are a shock, a spring, and the upper control arm. preludes do not have these. preludes have an actual upper control arm which is a completely seperate part than the shock strut

the proper wording for what preludes have is: coilover shock
 

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Discussion Starter #15
you totally just proved that i am indeed correct lol. read what you just wrote.

you're thinking shocks as in truck type shocks.
preludes have shock type struts. meaning they work only as a shock and spring.
struts (mcphereson struts) are a shock, a spring, and the upper control arm. preludes do not have these. preludes have an actual upper control arm which is a completely seperate part than the shock strut

the proper wording for what preludes have is: coilover shock

so if i were to order these things, i would get nothing but aluminum plates basically for $290 with no camber adjustability whatsoever correct?
 

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think of it this way, struts have a spring around them, shocks do not, like on trucks and a select few cars.
 

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so if i were to order these things, i would get nothing but aluminum plates basically for $290 with no camber adjustability whatsoever correct?
ED-ZACHARY.

for cars that use the sprung assembly to locate the spindle....the top of that assembly (where the pillow balls would go) dictates the angle of the spindle...which is the camber angle. (this is McPherson strut cars, mostly).

for cars that use an upper control arm to locate the spindle....the top of the sprung assembly has NOTHING to do with the angle of the spindle.. and hence, nothing to do with camber angle. (this is civics 88-01, preludes 84+, and accords 86 to 02)



think of it this way, struts have a spring around them, shocks do not, like on trucks and a select few cars.

think of it this way...you're uneducated (or under-educated) on the subject and should probably stop posting before you make yourself look like an idiot......

oops.....too late.

look.....Jaguar 'struts':


and....corvette 'struts':


and...84-87 civic 'shocks':



here's a better differentiation:

struts are designed to take the lateral loads of a wheel/tire assembly as replacements for upper control arms or other locating links as well as compressive loads seen during suspension travel.

shocks are designed to only take compressive loads seen during suspension travel, they do not have the ability to handle lateral loads.


under this defintion....tein's site is totally accurate. strut cars get the camber adjustment. the problem is, tein's site doesn't tell you that your car isn't a strut car.

you are supposed to know that BEFORE you start buying parts.

they probably know you don't know that, and will foolishly pay thru the nose for parts that'll do you little to no good.
 

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Discussion Starter #18 (Edited)
thank you for clarifying all of this... hence why i asked about something that i wasn't too sure about, that would cost me nearly $300, before i bought it. rep pts for you

the pic of the jaguar suspension is the perfect example. the shock tower IS the upper control arm


ED-ZACHARY.

for cars that use the sprung assembly to locate the spindle....the top of that assembly (where the pillow balls would go) dictates the angle of the spindle...which is the camber angle. (this is McPherson strut cars, mostly).

for cars that use an upper control arm to locate the spindle....the top of the sprung assembly has NOTHING to do with the angle of the spindle.. and hence, nothing to do with camber angle. (this is civics 88-01, preludes 84+, and accords 86 to 02)






think of it this way...you're uneducated (or under-educated) on the subject and should probably stop posting before you make yourself look like an idiot......

oops.....too late.

look.....Jaguar 'struts':


and....corvette 'struts':


and...84-87 civic 'shocks':



here's a better differentiation:

struts are designed to take the lateral loads of a wheel/tire assembly as replacements for upper control arms or other locating links as well as compressive loads seen during suspension travel.

shocks are designed to only take compressive loads seen during suspension travel, they do not have the ability to handle lateral loads.


under this defintion....tein's site is totally accurate. strut cars get the camber adjustment. the problem is, tein's site doesn't tell you that your car isn't a strut car.

you are supposed to know that BEFORE you start buying parts.

they probably know you don't know that, and will foolishly pay thru the nose for parts that'll do you little to no good.
 

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im editing this out to not egg this on

but thanks for being a dick psychoboy. you sure add a lot to educating ppl in this community. next time you want to prove someone wrong, prove them wrong and keep you little comments to yourself. this site is to educate and help ppl with their car problems, not to make them feel stupid and not want to use the site.
 

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But there's still no difference between using rubber top hats on the strut/spring and aluminum pillow ball mounts for the top of my suspension? It seems to me that the aluminum ones would keep strut play in check, but that's just me. But that's probably not worth $220 I'd imagine...correct? Apparently KYB makes some $9 upper strut mounts I'm going to go for... unless anyone has used a better part for the top of their suspension?
The Tein mounts help eliminate strut movement at the top. There isnt too much movement there unless the rubber in the mount in completely worn out and falling apart. These may help a tiny bit, but absolutely no where worth that kind of money to do just that. If they adjusted camber, i think pretty much all of us would be running these right now.
 
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