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Discussion Starter #1
Ok i just got this 91 b21a1 lude. I raced it today for the first time. I raced a 2001 civic si (B16 JDM)...... at the luanch my car took him on 1st and 2nd gear.... after that my car wouldnt pull no more.... Does this type of lude have low ends? It laggs on 3rd and 4th gear. :Rock:

Also what would help the car pull better on 3rd and 4th gear. Thanks
 

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well considering it was a b16a1? the vtec may have gotten you there, with my experience 3rd gear is awesome. but thats just me.
 

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I mean 1st and 2nd gear are the strongest gears on my car. Then after 3rd it doesnt pull as hard anymore.... especially 4th gear. I was still suprised i took him 1st gear lol. Almost all my freinds have 00 si's and Gsr's so im the slowest one right now :( its ok though.
 

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yours still looks the best lol. ive pulled a GSR before not for long but i did lol. I know my gears hit way harder then any of my friends, at least the ones with the same HP, plus you still have about as much TQ in your car as they do.
 

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Thats how gears work.
Lower gears = faster acceleration.

No n/a car in existance accelerates faster in 3rd gear then 2nd gear.
The only exceptions are if you can't get traction in the lower gears.
 
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exactly...i was going to say, put some thought into what you;re saying. ofcourse it doesnt pull in 4th. what stock car from 91 does?
 
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exactly...i was going to say, put some thought into what you;re saying. ofcourse it doesnt pull in 4th. what stock car from 91 does?
 

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Discussion Starter #8
ok you got the wrong idea.... this is an example: My freinds gsr is 5 speed and out of all the gears it pulls the strongest at 3rd gear.My other friend... his car is strongest at 3rd and 4th gear..... meaning that it doesnt pull that strong at 1st and 2nd.... Some other cars are better at 4th gear and 3rd. Im just wondering if that how this prelude was made..... to be strongest at 1st and 2nd gear..... you kno what i mean?
 

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Ok i think i know what you mean. and that usually happens to me when i mess around with people. I hold my own through 1st and 2nd but once i get into third its all over for me. Its wierd tho cuz when i'm in 4th or 5th I can tap the gas when i'm crusin at 40 and up and have no problem over takin people. And i'm pretty much stock with a very tired motor lol.

The gearing in our cars has confused me since i bought it. To me it seems like they couldn't make up their minds on if they wanted a wide gear box or close gear box. 1st and 2nd; and 4th and 5th are really close to each other but 3rd is alittle farther from both. It stands out most for me when i'm slowing down by just shifting down the gears. down shifting from 3rd to 2 is a big gap it seems.
 

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It may feel like it pulls harder in 3rd or fourth, but physics says it pulls hardest in first, then second, then third, then fourth, then fifth. Thats just how it works.

You may only gain 30mph during second gear while you gain 45mph in third (random made up numbers), but second still pulls "harder".


The 2nd-3rd shift is a big one, but if you wind it to the redline in 2nd it still drops you right next to the torque peak when you shift into third, which is roughly correct as far as gearbox design goes.

The thing to remember is that your racing a B16, they have 160hp (compared to your 135-140).
The trick to them, is that they have NO power under 6k, so first gear in a b16 is very very slow, you have to go through 5k before you get any power. Once you do get to 6k, it pulls hard, shifting into second leaves you above the vtec mark(6k), so it keeps pulling hard.

So heres how it works:

Prelude wins first gear, because we have the low end power to get into our powerband way before the civic does, this gives us a car length or two.

Civic wins second gear, but not by enough to pass the prelude, the lude should stil have half a car to a car and a bit at this point. The civic second gear lasts longer then the preludes, also, so the civic gets an extra burst of catch-up-ness when we shift and it's still in 2nd. At this point in time the civic is moving faster, but is still behind.

Now we're to third gear, a much longer pull then first or second.
The civic wins third gear, and more importantly it wins it by a good chunk.
The combination of shifting later, and being at a higher speed going in means that by the end of third gear for the prelude, the civic is only halfway through it's third gear, and going substantially faster.

Fourth gear is a dead loss for the prelude.



TL:DR version:
Civic = 160hp with proper gearing for it's powerband and a five year old engine.
Prelude = 135hp with proper gearing for it's powerband, and a seventeen year old engine.

Given roughly even drivers, the Civic wins.
 

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^^I agree with you, I guess I just mean that i wish 3rd was a little shorter. When i drive it just feels (really technical and sientific i know lol) like it should be alittle shorter compared to the other gears in the transmision cuz first and second are close and 4th and 5th are close. I'll double check to see if i'm just making this up when i drive to work but it seems like if i'm goin like 60mph in 5th and i drop to 4th the revs only raise about 1000, and if i drop from 2nd to 1st going 20 the revs raise 1000, but if you go from 3rd to 2nd at like 40 it raises 2000. You know what i mean?Maybe i'm doing a poor job of describing it haha.

Don't get me wrong tho i like this gear box cuz other than 3rd if you shift right were the power band starts to drop (on mine about 5900 +or- 100) i'll put you right where the power band gets juicy in the next gear. But like you said from 2nd to 3rd you have to rev all the way up to red line to put you in the good spot. Also i like it cuz going 70 mph (the ususal speed limit here in texas) in 5 puts me at about 3200 which is right were i my power band starts to get strong (well as strong as this tired little motor will get). so over taking is no prob and crusin at 90 on the 400 mile trip back home from skool isn't a problem either not even on gas mileage.
 

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On my 89 a shift from 4th to 5th at 65mph is, roughly speaking, 4000 in 4th to 3500 in 5th, very very short ratio change.

What i would do is move 4th down to make that a 800rpm shift (1.4k at redline or so, then move 3rd down slightly to put it closer to being centered between 2nd and 4th, but still on the 4th side of half.

Roughly speaking, like this:
1st.........2nd......3rd....4th..5th.

Though with the currant box shifting from 4th to 5th at 100-105mph sounds wonderful with a CAI :p
 

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exactly! thats about what i would do too. Some times i cruise around in fourth unknowingly especially on the long drive after i've had to slow down for a towns speed limits. I usualy catch it within a few miles tho. I've never gotten anywere above 95 cuz the tires i have on it right now are P rated and not in the greatest condition. Don't feel like having one pop at 100 and dying lol. I'm hoping to nab some ten spoke (i think) wheels from the 01-05 civics with decent tires from a friend of mine untill i can save up for some Speedy's with kumo ecsta's on them
 
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