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Old 04-18-2009, 08:36 PM   #1
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Rules: don't be afraid of verbal abuse. If you ask a dumb question that can be googled then you will likely see a little of it. This thread is for people to possibly learn a few things not to talk about the same things which have been discussed over and over. I'll answer but you will get my smartass comments along with it. Understood? Cool.
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Old 04-18-2009, 08:37 PM   #2
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Others can answer btw but I better not have to do any correcting.
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Old 04-18-2009, 08:45 PM   #3
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awesome, im going to ask my question that never got answered in the beginners guide to H22 modification thread

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Originally Posted by H22LudeSH View Post
Okay, so im really considering going with VAFC to gain some horsepower. I have few bolt-ons but I wouldn't consider it a good setup. I got an AEM CAI, and a Skunk2 MegaPower Cat-Back exhaust. I also have a 12lb flywheel if that means anything. Would I get anything noticable out of the VAFC with just an intake and a cat-back? Would you recommend VAFC for DD? Thanks in advance guys

oh and the link giving info about the VAFC is not working for me so if anyone wants a new one feel free to use this

http://www.hondahookup.com/forums/sh....php?p=1254605
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:27 PM   #4
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If you don't want to go through the troubles and expenses of full obd1 tuning then its not so bad. Especially if you don't plan on doing anything serious. Our preludes run really rich from the factory while in open loop aka ~wot. You can gaib some noticeable power with that unit but its nothing compared to a full tune
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Old 04-18-2009, 10:49 PM   #5
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Here comes mine, I finished my build last month and I run the motor with the stock p14, my H23vtec build consists of: crower stage 2 cams along with retainers and springs, 70mm TB, IM and head ported and polished, OEM size type s pistons, 8lb flywheel, bottom fully balanced, I ran the car with that ecu for about 900 miles, I'm not an expert and I followed the advice of the guy that built my engine, the car uses a lot of oil, when I push the gas I can see some dark gray smoke but not when it's at idle, the compression results came out as follows:
cyl 1= 195psi
cyl 2= 180psi
cyl 3= 185psi
cyl 4= 200psi
I have a basemapped ecu from mottoxxxman now and the car runs way much better but the damaged is already done.
My question is, what could have happened and why are the compression numbers so low?
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Old 04-18-2009, 11:14 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by meanshyguy View Post
Here comes mine, I finished my build last month and I run the motor with the stock p14, my H23vtec build consists of: crower stage 2 cams along with retainers and springs, 70mm TB, IM and head ported and polished, OEM size type s pistons, 8lb flywheel, bottom fully balanced, I ran the car with that ecu for about 900 miles, I'm not an expert and I followed the advice of the guy that built my engine, the car uses a lot of oil, when I push the gas I can see some dark gray smoke but not when it's at idle, the compression results came out as follows:
cyl 1= 195psi
cyl 2= 180psi
cyl 3= 185psi
cyl 4= 200psi
I have a basemapped ecu from mottoxxxman now and the car runs way much better but the damaged is already done.
My question is, what could have happened and why are the compression numbers so low?
your compression numbers are not necessarily low. Do you know the piston to wall used in your build and the ring gaps? Also, was the head rebuilt or was it reused from a previous engine?

your first mistake was to run the engine on a stock p14. This build is something the h23 ecu would have never seen coming. Im not going to say that this was the reason for your engine burning oil but it was not a good way to break in the engine.

What was your break in procedure?

Make a note that your inside cylinders have the lowest compression. These are also the cylinders that have the "same" rotation meaning the two inner cylinders are at the top of the stroke at one point and the outside cylinders are at the bottom of the stroke. After running the engine through the first heat cycle, did you go back and re torque the head studs? This really shouldnt have to be done but what did you torque the bolts to? and were you using factory head bolts or aftermarket studs?
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Old 04-19-2009, 01:28 AM   #7
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I didn't build my engine or know exactly about the piston to ring clearance, I hired some guy that was supposed to know his stuff and a good reputable machine shop to do the honing.
The head was rebuilt as well, I used the same valves though since I didn't feel the need to buy new ones, I also bought new valve seals and valve guides, they're Ferrea I think.
The brake in process was kind of dumb, this guy told me to let the car run on the diveway for about 2 hrs.
I did it for 45 mins and then another 45 the next day, then put about 150 miles on it on mostly highway driving, I found out later on that it's better to beat hard on it for the first 20 miles in order for the rings to seal propperly.
I used ARP head studs, didn't re-torque them. The car runs noticeable better after hooking up the ECU with the basemap for my ECU.
The guy who assembled the engine blamed it on me for letting the engine overheat a couple of times, but the temperature went down after the fans turned on and I drove away, also, I did a leak down test and no bubbles on the rad, no noisy on the TB or exhaust pipe, I didn't hear any noise at all on Cyl 1 and 4, I did hear noise on 2 and 3 though, coming from the dipstick and I think the valves as well, but I'm not sure because the noise was kind of loud at the dipstick, what do you think of what I just told you?
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Old 04-19-2009, 11:44 AM   #8
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i think the break in u did was completely wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!this could be the main reason for the lower numbers,,,the rings were not seated correctly!
get some new rings break it in correctly and head to the dyno with it
and i think this thread is a good idea
especially some of us really dont care if we get the f-word pointed are way
as long as we get the info we wanted
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Old 04-19-2009, 01:32 PM   #9
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VTEC OIl pressure switch question:



I read that the plug on my vtec solenoid is sposed to be where the oil pressure switch should go.

But I've also noticed that there's a threaded hole to the right of the vtec solenoid that looks like it could be the pressure switch as well.

So, my question is, do I have to take that plug out and put the switch in there, or can i just screw the plug into the hole to the right of the solenoid, and it be ok there?

I bought the head without random parts, and it didn't come with the pressure switch, and I don't know where to install it, considering this is my first vtec build.
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Old 04-19-2009, 04:04 PM   #10
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Hey I got a newbie question. I have this module that I'm hooking up that supposed to adjust air to fuel mixture and I've tried looking through google and got no where. Does the 1990 Honda Prelude SR's have MAFS's and where the hell are they? They are supposed to be attached to the air cleaner piping close to the throttle body right? Can't find it if so.
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Old 04-19-2009, 05:07 PM   #11
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preludes will not have a maf on the intake piping like older gm's
they use a map sensor for measuring load and incoming air

the module u are talking about sounds like afc by apexi
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Old 04-20-2009, 12:09 AM   #12
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.... < yup. lol Thanks a ton. I ended up googling the apexi's afc's and finding one simular to mine called neo. It ended up having a diagram for the prelude showing on the ecu power, ground, rpm, pressure, and throttle. God don't you hate it when something right in front of you gets pointed out:P thanks man.
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Old 04-20-2009, 12:10 AM   #13
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But would it be easier to connect right up at the ecu or the two wires on the map sensor?
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Old 04-20-2009, 08:46 AM   #14
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I dont know if this should go here, but if it doesnt get answered I will make a thread in a few days. I have an 2001 base and hooked up a VAFC and everything seems like its supposed too except when i let the car sit overnight or for more than 6 hours. it will crank and crank then kinda fire up back fire then die. It will die even if I hold the throttle half way, I do need a TPS but it was fine before I installed this. and I double, triple, quadrople checked wiring, i mean really i checked it a shitload before I even turned it over. Any helf would be great! thanks.
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Old 04-20-2009, 08:57 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlWhitePrelude01 View Post
I dont know if this should go here, but if it doesnt get answered I will make a thread in a few days. I have an 2001 base and hooked up a VAFC and everything seems like its supposed too except when i let the car sit overnight or for more than 6 hours. it will crank and crank then kinda fire up back fire then die. It will die even if I hold the throttle half way, I do need a TPS but it was fine before I installed this. and I double, triple, quadrople checked wiring, i mean really i checked it a shitload before I even turned it over. Any helf would be great! thanks.
sounds like a problem not related to ur wiring to the afc
but if the tps is bad it can cause all sorts of things to go bad
fix that first it need to be fixed to get to the bottom of ur problem

and wire the afc at the ecu,it is easier and the wiring stays better in side the car
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Old 04-20-2009, 02:13 PM   #16
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I did hook up everything at the ecu. all the sensors work on the unit display so i got those hooked up right. and my "new" (used) throttle body will be in this week so today after work im gonna try unpluggin the VAFC and start it that way to see if its better, I dont think it will help because I wont have a complete circuit I dont think. the wiring for that confuses the hell outta me haha. If i figure out how to post vids I will take a one and post it. Oh and after it starts and the car is still warm it doesnt have a problem at all fires right up. this only happens after sittin for 4 or more hours.
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Old 04-20-2009, 02:53 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 91OEMLude View Post
VTEC OIl pressure switch question:



I read that the plug on my vtec solenoid is sposed to be where the oil pressure switch should go.

But I've also noticed that there's a threaded hole to the right of the vtec solenoid that looks like it could be the pressure switch as well.

So, my question is, do I have to take that plug out and put the switch in there, or can i just screw the plug into the hole to the right of the solenoid, and it be ok there?

I bought the head without random parts, and it didn't come with the pressure switch, and I don't know where to install it, considering this is my first vtec build.
http://images.google.com/imghp?hl=en&tab=wi

www.spoonhonda.com - online prelude manual

sorry but thats exactly the crap i dont want in this thread. Something you could find on your own in about 10 minutes if you just searched google.
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Old 04-20-2009, 02:55 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by 1990TheLudeSR View Post
But would it be easier to connect right up at the ecu or the two wires on the map sensor?
connect everything at the ecu. If you are not good with a soldering gun then i would recommend picking up a plug and play wiring harness. These can be bought from www.boomslang.us
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Old 04-20-2009, 02:57 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by PearlWhitePrelude01 View Post
I dont know if this should go here, but if it doesnt get answered I will make a thread in a few days. I have an 2001 base and hooked up a VAFC and everything seems like its supposed too except when i let the car sit overnight or for more than 6 hours. it will crank and crank then kinda fire up back fire then die. It will die even if I hold the throttle half way, I do need a TPS but it was fine before I installed this. and I double, triple, quadrople checked wiring, i mean really i checked it a shitload before I even turned it over. Any helf would be great! thanks.
eliminate your issues. It started when you put the vafc in. Take the vafc off and put all the wires back to factory. See if it still does it. If it does, then that checks off something from your list.
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Old 04-20-2009, 04:27 PM   #20
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I got a riddle for you. Okay my car was running off a piggyback(AEM fi/c) and i swapped over to to a chipped p28. I got the ecu with a basemap made by motto. Well since it was a piggback the wires were all hacked. Well i rewired everything the best i could. Soldered everything and im 95% sure my wiring is good. Well now my car barely starts. When it does finally start it runs rele loppy and rough. It runs like shit. It struggles to pick up rpms to whe you give it gas. Like it shudders. And by the time the motor warms up it leans all the way out. Like blank on the wideband. What could my problem be? I got it towed to the shop and so far they cant figure it out. The guy doesnt like that i didnt go with a standalone like he recommended me and doesnt really seem like he wants to work on my car. But he did say all the work i did with the wires looks fine. Any idea's?
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DD: 1998 Honda Prelude
-Built.. to much to list. 327whp 292wtq @ 15psi
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Old 04-20-2009, 04:43 PM   #21
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my take is crome is shitty,hence the cheap price
it is just hit or miss
my car also screw up on the dyno,,,, and the proble was crome
as soon as we switched over to aem the car was good to go
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Old 04-20-2009, 05:37 PM   #22
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the map you get from moto is not a tuned map. It is a guess as to what will run your car. And no two cars will run the same on the same map. Too many variables. If you bought the ecu believing your car would run perfect well then you need to just put the stock ecu back in.

You need to have a tuner look at it.


and beyond that, you need to have someone look at your wiring. Do you have any check engine lights?
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Old 04-20-2009, 06:00 PM   #23
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Quote:
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the map you get from moto is not a tuned map. It is a guess as to what will run your car. And no two cars will run the same on the same map. Too many variables. If you bought the ecu believing your car would run perfect well then you need to just put the stock ecu back in.

You need to have a tuner look at it.


and beyond that, you need to have someone look at your wiring. Do you have any check engine lights?
i'll add to this so you know a bit more involved:
i sent 2 chips, one for the stock map sensor, one for a gm 3bar map sensor. both chips make it run 100% identical. both maps are intentionally set up to be a bit rich at all points, as usual for a basemap leaving room for error.
i suggested some things to have the mechanic do to test stuff out, and the mechanic seems to be acting like he refuses to listen to anyone but himself and refuses to check what i mentioned to check. and his inspections of everything else he has done sound a bit shaky. he keeps insisting theres no point in checking much else because the ecu itsself is bad. not the chips, not the stuff that he refuses to even check, but the ecu. which is possible, considering the wiring nightmares this car has seen, but the ecu was 100% perfect when i shipped it, even drove my car with my chip in it for a few minutes to test it out and make sure it's issue free.
but back to the mechanic: he's claiming the car is going into limp mode. yet the car isnt able to run because its leaning out so much after its been started and idling for a minute. and we both know limp mode = richer. and combined with larger than stock injectors, that means very very rich. and i know the maps i made for him, and have checked them multiple times, and for every reason it should be running somewhat richer than ideal, nothing that could possibly make it run so lean that it actually stalls out.
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Old 04-20-2009, 06:03 PM   #24
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ah, i didnt even see that he was turbo, lol. Guess he cant really go to the stock ecu lmao.

take it to a REAL shop that deals with performance.
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Old 04-20-2009, 06:09 PM   #25
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flame if needed but just throwing something out there... I'm considering bumping the compression in my h23. Doing some research I understand that the h22-h23 blocks are similar and use the 87mm bore. The h23 has a stroke of 95mm. Using the h23 crank, and modified floating wrist pin rods (best option?), and h22a type s pistons I would have a estimated 13.1:1 CR . My only question is that the h23 uses the shorter rods for the longer stroke and with the type s piston is would stick aprox .020inches out of the hole. Would a thicker head gasket fix this problem or is something needed to be done to the combustion chambers on the h23 head. Or if that difference nothing serious? I'm not expecting a high hp h23 but hopefully a torquey h23.
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