Need help ASAP. Car got overheated...now it won't even start. [Archive] - Honda Prelude Forum : Honda Prelude Forums

: Need help ASAP. Car got overheated...now it won't even start.


webglasses
04-16-2011, 12:38 PM
I have a 99 SH Prelude. The car got overheated bc of a coolant leak from the main line (the radiator hose to the engine). There was a cut on hose so the coolant got all over the engine bay. The car shut off when I got almost to the house. Replace the radiator hose...it starts fine for a couple of days...then it won't start...it only cranks. Replace the ignition coil and the module inside the distributor cap bc it was going bad. It works after pushed start the car...starts fine for another couple of days. Now it doesn't even starts...a weak crank for a couple of seconds...then only a clicking noise now. What is the problem with my car? Much help is appreciated.

Wing8806
04-16-2011, 12:39 PM
Have you checked your spark plugs? Have you had your starter checked?

webglasses
04-16-2011, 12:49 PM
the starter is still new...change it half a year ago. Check the spark plugs is was dry except for the the 4th plug

Wing8806
04-16-2011, 12:57 PM
Just because it's new doesn't mean not check it lol. There's always a chance something went wrong - better safe than sorry.


So your coolant is topped, and it ran after you fixed the leak. At lest it doesn't sound like you seized the motor.

webglasses
04-16-2011, 01:02 PM
Yeah...it ran after I got it fixed. The car cranks, but it doesn't crank anymore only clicking sound. I check the starter after it died on me...so it's still good.

Wing8806
04-16-2011, 01:19 PM
Stupid question - is your battery good, and have you checked that your grounds are tight?

webglasses
04-16-2011, 01:26 PM
Yeah...I took the battery to autozone and they it was 89% charged...so it good. I checked the ground also. Could it be the fuel pump or the injectors?

Wing8806
04-16-2011, 01:36 PM
It's possible the fuel pump. But you would still be able to start up with the leftover fuel in the system. It would run for 10 seconds or so but it'd still run.


I kill my fuelpump power too many times and forget about it - surprised it's not burned up yet.



Howabout your ignition switch? on some years there was a recall.... do a quick search on the symptoms for that real quick


edit*

http://www.preludepower.com/forums/showthread.php?t=341545&highlight=ignition+switch
http://www.preludepower.com/forums/showthread.php?t=338037&highlight=ignition+switch
http://www.preludepower.com/forums/showthread.php?t=338383&highlight=ignition+switch

webglasses
04-16-2011, 02:05 PM
The recalls for the ignition switch is only for 97s and 98s...so mine is rule out. Still looking around to see what the symptoms are.

psud3ity
04-16-2011, 03:38 PM
Check your coolant and oil for contamination. If you see a milky brown sludge in either you probably warped the head. Do a compression test as well just to make sure you still have compression in the motor. Either would indicate a headgasket.

webglasses
04-16-2011, 03:42 PM
Alright...I'll check that. How hard it is to fix the warped head is the problem?

webglasses
04-16-2011, 03:53 PM
I just checked both...there are not any milky brown sludge. But my oil cap smell like gas...don't know how that get into my motor...probably from the spark plugs I'm guessing.

Shiloh51933
04-16-2011, 05:27 PM
I just checked both...there are not any milky brown sludge. But my oil cap smell like gas...don't know how that get into my motor...probably from the spark plugs I'm guessing.

Possibly plugs, more likely injector seals since you ran her overheated. U know now to never run a.motor u care about overheating, pull over.and.shut. I'd tow mine home or try and diagnose/repair onsite. Bad injectors would make more sense from your posted symptoms. If you haven't done a compression test then do a test asap and I would bechecking your injectors.

psud3ity
04-16-2011, 05:30 PM
Alright...I'll check that. How hard it is to fix the warped head is the problem?

Some heads can be redecked by a machine shop. I had to do that on my BMW when I let it overheat and the head warped. $500 later... Not to mention you're taking the ENTIRE engine apart to replace the gasket.

I just checked both...there are not any milky brown sludge. But my oil cap smell like gas...don't know how that get into my motor...probably from the spark plugs I'm guessing.

That's a good sign that theres not any milky stuff in your coolant, that means that oil hasn't found it's way in there which would be a sign of a blown headgasket/warped head. As for the gas smell, you may have flooded the engine trying to start it. Take the plugs out, pull the fuel pump fuse, and crank the motor a few times. That should clear the flooding condition. Wipe the excess gas off the plugs and put the fuse back in.

In EXTREME cases (Learned this trick from RX7 owners, rotaries are notorious for flooding if you start the car, move it 5 feet, and then park) gas can contaminate the oil, and that will cause a low compression state, which is only compounded by trying to start the car, which adds more fuel to the problem. A quick way to raise compression is to remove the plugs, take a teaspoon of oil and drop it in each cylinder through the plug holes, If you have a syringe and can shoot it directly onto the piston through the hole it works best. This artificially raises the compression of the motor a bit. Put her back together and start the car. EXPECT LOTS OF SMOKE. LOTS. Until that oil burns off at least. Do NOT try this in a closed garage. The car may stall out once the oil burns off, and that would indicate your compression is still too low to run the car. I'd suggest changing the oil and trying again at that point. But at least you may be able to get it started.

Good luck. I can't agree with shiloh more though, DO NOT RUN A CAR OVERHEATED. EVER. Tow it home.

webglasses
04-16-2011, 06:30 PM
The plugs were kinda of wet and it was kinda of black (probably from the gas). The car doesn't even crank...just clicking noise now. I probably change the oil tomorrow and see what happen. Also need the compression tool to do the compression test. How do I do the oil test if it doesn't even cranks?

psud3ity
04-17-2011, 12:46 AM
The plugs were kinda of wet and it was kinda of black (probably from the gas). The car doesn't even crank...just clicking noise now. I probably change the oil tomorrow and see what happen. Also need the compression tool to do the compression test. How do I do the oil test if it doesn't even cranks?

Did you burn out your starter or kill your battery? Jump start the thing. If it's your starter going bad you can try either jumping the car directly from the post on the starter (negative terminal to - battery, + terminal to the post on the starter). Sometimes hitting it with a high enough voltage will force the starter motor to turn. Other trick would be having someone hold the key in the start position and hitting the starter motor with a hammer. If the brushes in the starter are binding either way is likely to break them free.

webglasses
04-17-2011, 11:38 AM
Maybe...I'll try to hit the starter and see what's up. I'm going to change the oil while I'm at it. Hopefully it will run.

webglasses
04-17-2011, 11:39 AM
This is a stupid question...Does having gas in the motor lower the compression?

webglasses
04-17-2011, 04:36 PM
Just change the oil...my battery was low, so I went to Autozone and got it recharge. The only problem right now is there is no spark so the car won't start. What is the problem? The mechanic that came to my house thinks is the distributor...but I'm going to check the spark plug wires first. Any suggestions?

webglasses
04-18-2011, 07:24 PM
bump for more help...and updates - just change the distributor from the junkyard...still doesn't work. No sparks at all. Will the a bad ECM be causing this?

prodigyofchaos
04-18-2011, 09:31 PM
when i wasn't getting spark it was the ground for my engine. i would check that since it is cheap

webglasses
04-18-2011, 10:17 PM
Where do you check that? I checked the ground for the battery...both at the passenger headlight and the transmission...is that the same thing?

gearshredder
04-18-2011, 10:26 PM
Well, Have you checked ALL your fuses? Start with that.
Try starting it with starting fluid does it start?
No spark? pull the wire from the ignition coil. Spark there?
DON'T THROW PARTS AT IT!
Check for voltage at the coil. If you know know how, get a meter and a manual.
Get a noid light tester, check for injector firing.
When a mechanic says "Thinks", Don't go replacing the distributor.

gearshredder
04-18-2011, 10:27 PM
Forget the ground, just bypass it, get a jumper cable and connect just The black wire. One from the negative on the battery and one to somewhere on the engine. Don't touch the red wire. Or just get a scrap piece of wire or something.

webglasses
04-18-2011, 10:31 PM
Yeah...we checked all the fuses and the connection...all are good. I checked everything before started to buy stuffs. Haven't try starting fluid yet...how do you do that?

gearshredder
04-18-2011, 10:45 PM
spray right into the intake right at the throttle body. Then try to start.
on the back of the can itll tell you how much to spray. id say a couple seconds with the throttle part open

Shiloh51933
04-19-2011, 06:47 AM
Has anyone hooked up a scanner to point you in the right direction, sounds like your timing via PCM or one of the sensors(CKP,CYP,TDC) that feed the PCM info.. An OBD II scanner should tell you something if your not getting spark like you said. That distributor you got was used right, it could be bad itself since they seem to be problematic on some of them.

psud3ity
04-19-2011, 10:57 AM
Has anyone hooked up a scanner to point you in the right direction, sounds like your timing via PCM or one of the sensors(CKP,CYP,TDC) that feed the PCM info.. An OBD II scanner should tell you something if your not getting spark like you said. That distributor you got was used right, it could be bad itself since they seem to be problematic on some of them.

Good point. I'm not sure which one but I believe one of those sensors being bad can cause a no spark condition. That said, I'm more inclined to believe that since the OP didn't have trouble until he overheated the car, that overheating is still at the root of the issue.

Shiloh51933
04-19-2011, 11:27 AM
Good point. I'm not sure which one but I believe one of those sensors being bad can cause a no spark condition. That said, I'm more inclined to believe that since the OP didn't have trouble until he overheated the car, that overheating is still at the root of the issue.
Yes the overheating was more than likely the seed that his issue stemmed from but in turn running the engine at high temps can cause sensors to overheat circuits. Also, I don't remember if the OP stated if any coolant was in the engine bay or not.

Dominican
04-19-2011, 01:06 PM
this definitely sounds like a problem in ignition, not fuel, and not a blown gasket.

psud3ity
04-19-2011, 01:32 PM
this definitely sounds like a problem in ignition, not fuel, and not a blown gasket.

True. I can't see overheating causing an issue with a TDC, CKP sensor etc..

I'm willing to suspect that junkyard dizzy though. definatley.

webglasses
04-19-2011, 02:27 PM
Yeah the coolant got all over the engine bay. I bought the distributor from the junkyard and change the ignitor and it still doesn't spark. So will the PCM or ECM tell me where there is no sparks? I was thinking the main relay or the ECM is bad.

psud3ity
04-19-2011, 02:30 PM
Yeah the coolant got all over the engine bay. I bought the distributor from the junkyard and change the ignitor and it still doesn't spark. So will the PCM or ECM tell me where there is no sparks? I was thinking the main relay or the ECM is bad.

Start testing relays... A codereader would diagnose a faulty CKP/TDC sensor pretty quickly I believe.

webglasses
04-19-2011, 02:45 PM
Where do I test the relay? You mean the main relay?

psud3ity
04-19-2011, 02:52 PM
Where do I test the relay? You mean the main relay?

I was referring to all the relays and wiring that may have been exposed to coolant. A multimeter should do the trick. Dirty little secret about automotive relays is they're basically all the same. Grab the service manual and find the troubleshooting section for the ignition system, follow the steps.

webglasses
04-19-2011, 02:54 PM
The mechanic check all the wires and they got power. What is a sign of a bad main relay? I can feel it click when I turn the key to "ON" position. Would a bad main relay to cause it not to spark?

Shiloh51933
04-20-2011, 04:51 AM
Start testing relays... A codereader would diagnose a faulty CKP/TDC sensor pretty quickly I believe.

Thats what I posted earlier, get a obd 2 scanner, this will either show u problem area or atleast rule out possible problem area's. If you don't have or fi.d somebody with then get a manual, otherwise it's a matter of elimination.

ranmaxx2
04-20-2011, 05:03 AM
good luck, hope you find the problem soon!!!

Shiloh51933
04-20-2011, 10:32 AM
Yeah the coolant got all over the engine bay. I bought the distributor from the junkyard and change the ignitor and it still doesn't spark. So will the PCM or ECM tell me where there is no sparks? I was thinking the main relay or the ECM is bad.
How do u know it's not getting spark? Each spark plug wire wasn't getting spark? What about your coil? I know you said u copped another from JY but did u check to see if it was any good? If your getting no spark it's either the sensors not giving signals to PCM, PCM not giving signals to coil(which is inside distributor housing). I believe we can rule out all your spark plug wires being bad at the same time. No spark means bad PCM or sensor or distributor. You might have got another bad distributor from salvage yard or as I believe a bad sensor, unless it your cap or rotor. I doubt it your PCM itself and from what you posted it sounds like a bad sensor. Unless you never checked your cap/rotor. Check to see if your rotor spins when cranking over and be careful doing this(disconnect all electric connectors at the distributor). Hope this helps.

webglasses
04-20-2011, 02:27 PM
Its not getting sparks because we checked with the spark plug wires...by unscrewing the spark plugs from the motor and hooking it up to wires and put is against the motor while turning the engine. We test all the plugs. The distributor I got from the junkyard was bad so I switch the ignition module control (ICM) from autozone (they test it so it should be good) which is inside the distributor. We check the cap and rotor too...they are good and it spins. So not problem there. Which sensor do I check?
I rule out the main relay bc the Accord have the same relay. Test the relay from the Prelude on my brother's Accord and its starts. The only other thing is get a new distributor or ECM. I probably overlooking something...so what else did I miss? I might have to tow to a shop and let them look at it.

pIERCE
04-20-2011, 04:16 PM
If you need starting fluid to start a modern fuel injected and computer controlled vehicle, something else is wrong.

boymeetsfence
04-20-2011, 05:38 PM
Get a Helms manual, you can d/l the whole thing for free HERE (http://www.spoonertuner.com/manuals?SID=ac6d0235eaff4a0e4b2b2bafb977fa34)
Follow the troubleshooting for no spark, this will take you through every possibly scenario and help you solve the problem.

fei8lo
04-20-2011, 08:12 PM
Is the starter still only clicking, or does it crank properly? You mentioned it is clicking but it is unclear to me if it is actaully cranking at the moment.

GreenLude
04-20-2011, 10:08 PM
The recalls for the ignition switch is only for 97s and 98s...so mine is rule out. Still looking around to see what the symptoms are.


This isn't true mine is a 99 and the dealership replaced mine for me free of charge.

gearshredder
04-20-2011, 11:18 PM
Shiloh51933 is right. You only checked if the WIRES were getting spark not whether the coil was giving spark. What if you cap is cracked or your distributor rotor is grounding out? Well check it again. Did you use the starting fluid in the car did it work? just for kicks do it. Any check engine lights? codes? You aren't giving all the info. Did you get a wiring diagram yet? Check the power to the coil. That would test for ignition switch working and other problems. I'm trying to help!!!! lol

If you need starting fluid to start a modern fuel injected and computer controlled vehicle, something else is wrong.

Starting fluid is used for diagnosis

Shiloh51933
04-21-2011, 05:43 AM
Its not getting sparks because we checked with the spark plug wires...by unscrewing the spark plugs from the motor and hooking it up to wires and put is against the motor while turning the engine. We test all the plugs. The distributor I got from the junkyard was bad so I switch the ignition module control (ICM) from autozone (they test it so it should be good) which is inside the distributor. We check the cap and rotor too...they are good and it spins. So not problem there. Which sensor do I check?
I rule out the main relay bc the Accord have the same relay. Test the relay from the Prelude on my brother's Accord and its starts. The only other thing is get a new distributor or ECM. I probably overlooking something...so what else did I miss? I might have to tow to a shop and let them look at it.
You replaced the ignition module or ICM but did you test ignition coil? I never thought it was a bad relay as you proved already. The sensors I'm referring to are; Crankshaft Position sensor, Cylinder Position sensor and Top dead center snsors. I believe you should be most interested in the CKP-crankshaft position. The CKP is behind the crankshaft pulley I believe, best/easiest way to check if faulty is with an OBDII scanner. You can check for bad grounds or loose connections by testing resistance between the terminals should be 1.2-3.2kohms. If not than replace sensor but like I said a scanner can do this much quicker easier but still good to check the grounds/connections, good wrenching.

webglasses
04-21-2011, 02:53 PM
Is the starter still only clicking, or does it crank properly? You mentioned it is clicking but it is unclear to me if it is actaully cranking at the moment.

The car is cranking properly...no more clicking because the battery was bad.

I got the ignition coil new from autozone and they test to see if it good...which it was before I paid for it. Can someone give me the download link the Helms manual again because the one above is no good. Don't you have to open the timing belt cover the get to the CKP sensor? If not, I'll check that and see. I check the ground with the multimeter and it gave 12.2 Volt. Also, I'm going to get the OBDII reader and see if my ECM is giving me any code.

How do you check to see if the ignition coil is getting any sparks? The mechanic check the wire that connect to the ignition coil while I was cranking the car and the power was good.

boymeetsfence
04-21-2011, 11:52 PM
The link is correct, the site is down or something. The home page is http://www.spoonertuner.com/

gearshredder
04-22-2011, 12:04 AM
Go find yourself a new mechanic. Good luck.

Shiloh51933
04-22-2011, 02:18 PM
The car is cranking properly...no more clicking because the battery was bad.

I got the ignition coil new from autozone and they test to see if it good...which it was before I paid for it. Can someone give me the download link the Helms manual again because the one above is no good. Don't you have to open the timing belt cover the get to the CKP sensor? If not, I'll check that and see. I check the ground with the multimeter and it gave 12.2 Volt. Also, I'm going to get the OBDII reader and see if my ECM is giving me any code.

How do you check to see if the ignition coil is getting any sparks? The mechanic check the wire that connect to the ignition coil while I was cranking the car and the power was good.

If autozone checked your ignition coil for you then it should be good but if you still wanna check; unplug 4 prong connector at coil wire and take your ohmeter to measure resistance between terminal a/c(0.64-0.78) check terminals A and B A/B for continuity. When doing this key is in OFF position. If there's no continuity between A and B coil is no good and if ohms arent between .64-.78 your coil is no good. I still think it's your crank position sensor or PCM, have you tried testing the sensor yet like I suggested. It seems like you've done quite a bit and there's not much left but your sensors or PCM to the ignition system. Your Top Dead Center right? Just get a scanner and your life will be easier...Good Wrenching my dude and I hope I've helped you more than confusing you.

webglasses
04-22-2011, 04:00 PM
Got the OBD 2 scanner and is not throwing any code. The car doesn't have an engine light to start with, so I figure the scanner won't detect any. Got the service manual so I'm going to start with diagnosing from the beginning.
Don't worry, your a big help shiloh.

Shiloh51933
04-22-2011, 04:23 PM
Got the OBD 2 scanner and is not throwing any code. The car doesn't have an engine light to start with, so I figure the scanner won't detect any. Got the service manual so I'm going to start with diagnosing from the beginning.
Don't worry, your a big help shiloh.

I forgot that when you disconnect the battery as you did cause you got a new battery you erased the memory of trouble codes. Try to start it then shut key off and do that again a few times with your scanner hooked up. Hopefully this will be enough to get a DTC and going back over your work is always helpful. I was working on one of my rides(Volvo 850) doing an overhaul replacing/upgrading quite a few things and after I was done I pulled a code. I thought I was going crazy because the code was one of the components I just replaced, to make a long story short...I forgot to plug the connector back into it's place. You could be overlooking something, good wrenching and let us know what happens.